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Mobilité des avocats: Le Barreau ratifie l'Accord
L'équipe Droit-Inc
2013-03-22 17:45:00
C’est fait! Réunis à Québec, les membres du Conseil général du Barreau du Québec viennent d'approuver l'Accord de libre circulation nationale 2013 (ALCN 2013)...
« L'Ontario et la Saskatchewan ont déjà ratifié cette entente qui permettra à terme à un avocat québécois de devenir membre d'un barreau d'une autre province ou territoire, et vice-versa, sans examen de transfert », explique le bâtonnier du Québec, Me Nicolas Plourde.
« Les différences entre les juridictions de droit civil et de common law ne justifiaient plus l'existence de barrières entre les juridictions. La société de droit envoie un message fort et souhaite une mobilité totale entre les provinces. Cet accord va permettre à la communauté juridique canadienne d'être fin prête à relever les défis de la mondialisation », ajoute le bâtonnier Plourde.
Le Barreau du Québec s'affaire donc dès maintenant à préparer un projet de règlement ou de modification réglementaire pour donner suite à la signature de l'ALCN 2013. Ce projet devant être soumis au Conseil général de juin 2013 pour adoption en vue d'être acheminé par la suite à l'Office des professions, pour adoption finale par le gouvernement. L'entente devrait entrer en en vigueur d'ici 12 à 18 mois, mentionne le directeur général du Barreau, Me Claude Provencher.
« La protection du public sera par ailleurs assurée, considérant que les principes de déontologie sont les mêmes à travers le Canada. Ainsi, un avocat hors Québec qui viendrait pratiquer ici ne doit pas accepter de prendre une affaire pour laquelle il n'a pas les connaissances nécessaires et vice versa », ajoute Me Provencher.
Rappelons que la libre circulation des membres de la profession juridique au Canada est actuellement régie par quatre accords : l'Accord de libre circulation nationale (« ALCN »), l'Accord de libre circulation territoriale (« ALCT »), l'Accord de libre circulation au Québec (« ALCQ ») et l'Addenda à l'Accord de libre circulation au Québec (« Addenda »).
Rappel
Le 11 novembre 2010, entrait en vigueur le Règlement sur les autorisations légales d'exercer la profession d'avocat hors du Québec qui donnent ouverture au permis du Barreau du Québec. Ce règlement prévoit qu'un avocat d'une autre province canadienne peut devenir membre du Barreau du Québec s'il réussit trois examens. Devant le succès de ces mesures, le Barreau du Québec a décidé de mettre le cap sur une mobilité pleine et entière entre les provinces canadiennes. Ce nouvel ALCN a été adopté à l'unanimité par le Conseil de la FOPJC en février dernier et doit maintenant être ratifié par les tous les barreaux provinciaux.
La mobilité internationale
Rappelons enfin que le Barreau du Québec a ratifié l'Entente Québec-France sur la reconnaissance mutuelle des qualifications professionnelles et qu'en octobre 2008, le Barreau du Québec et le Conseil national des Barreaux français signaient un Arrangement de reconnaissance mutuelle des qualifications (ARM). Depuis lors, la reconnaissance des qualifications professionnelles des avocats québécois et français est effective moyennant la réussite d'un examen oral portant sur la réglementation et la déontologie de l'avocat. Une cinquantaine d'avocats québécois et français se sont prévalus de cet accord Québec-France et sont devenus avocats dans l'autre juridiction.
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Lawyer
il y a 12 ansOnce again, this is a horrible decision, and with due respect Mtre Plourde, the difference do justify the barriers. Not only the legal differences but also the legal education, what's the purpose of having a civil law degree and a common law degree if both give access to the same?
Why would someone do a one year common law after civil law now?
Me(e)
il y a 12 ansLawyer, I understand your comment and I am also concerned about this issue. YEt, I think that a Québec lawyer who decides to go to Ontario for instance, will not be competitive to get a position in trusts, torts, etc. If he had a common law degree, then he would be more competitive. I think that the market will decide whether a common law degree after a civil la degree is an asset or not, and vice versa.
One example is the Law Society of ENgland and Wales. Foreign lawyers may take a conversion course to qualify as a SOlicitor, which is less onerous than getting the qualification from scratch. However, between a Solicitor who studied in the U.K and qualified there and a solicitor who requalified, the choice is clear for law firms. For some reasons, they do not fully recognize the transfer test. Even if both are solicitors, the one who re-qualified usually finds is difficult to get a job.
T
Therefore: getting a title is not everything. The market has yet to recognize it.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansYou are assuming that the public knows the difference...
You're Incorrect
il y a 12 ansThe professionals who will migrate between the two provinces will be predominantly bilingual, well educated, and skilled in the practice of corporate law. The "public" you speak of is not Mom and Pop sole proprietors in Rimouski seeking to incorporate and issue securities to the public. Indeed, the prestigious business clients that will be making use of these increasingly mobile professionals will be able to dictate, as market-makers, what skillsets they require to meet their needs. Furthermore, the firms who will presumptively hire these increasingly mobile lawyers will still decide, on their own internal metrics, what is a competitive skillset.
Believe in the market. Have faith in the invisible hand. Less regulation is better for our province, and the prosperity of our whole nation.
Embrace change.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansYour point of view is wishful thinking taken to its extreme. Seriously, the lawyers who will migrate will be "well-educated"? Really, do you believe they’ll have a law degree maybe?
Contrary to what you seem to assume, most lawyers do not practice in large firms and “prestigious business clients” are not the only ones who retain lawyers by the way. Even when they do, they sometimes do it on wrong assumptions. Lawyers from small to the big firm are liable to
I assume (my turn) that you work in a specialized field in a big firm to have that point of view. It's time to take off the blinders and look at what the practice of law really is for the majority of the 24,000 members in Québec.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansImaginez le portrait:
- La pauv'tite M'aam McDuff, représentée par son filleul serviable (qui travaille habituellement à Kitchener, mais qui a pri une journée de vacance pour venir aider sa maraine), se fait "ramasser" devant un tribunal Québécois. L'avocat de l'autre partie pratique au Québec depuis toujours, connait bien le droit québécois, et c'est le demolition Derby.
- Le juge Ti'Paul, qui vient d'être "élevé" à la magistrature, a encore ses réflexes d'avocat, une tendance certaine à l'interventionisme, et pense que la tite' madame a raison sur le fond.
Quelle sera la dynamique dans la salle d'audience ?
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansEn fait le juge va rejeter le recours, la marraine va poursuivre son filleul (avec un avocat de gatineau cette fois-ci, elle aura compris), et nos primes vont augmenter.
Me Jon
il y a 12 ansThis is a joke! Why would anyone do the Barreau du Quebec! I felt like I was back in grade school during that program...bye bye barreau and bye bye big law firms in Montreal! Toronto has just taken over...
Plourde this is embarassing!
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansYou need a common law degree to write the bar another province. As such, students will have to decide between taking their chance of the bar or spending an extra year in law school.
Lawyer
il y a 12 ansnonsense, McGill won't do the Quebec Bar anymore, nor will civil law student who do the dual program in 3 years(sherbrooke and UdM for example)
anonymous
il y a 12 ansThis is a far-reaching decision that has not been appropriately discussed by Quebec Bar members. A forum for discussion/opposition is absolutely needed. Regardless if this initiative has been in the works for the past 10 years, it only recently came to the attention of everyone that this was going to become a reality.
The following are major concerns:
1. Protection of the public. (Me. Marseille had a good post)
2. The value of studying civil law will be severely diminished.
3. The important differences in the two systems of law require that a demanding professional exam be administered to confirm competency.
4. Hey, why write the Quebec Bar - let's take the easy path through Ontario? A number of people that couldn't pass the Quebec Bar, and honestly don't have what it takes, see this as an opportunity to get around that previous roadblock and are rejoicing at this decision.
Me. Plourde and the Barreau executive need to consult the lawyers of the Province of Quebec - this decision of theirs was clearly not well thought through. I would argue that they do not have the mandate from Quebec Bar members to make such a huge decision without a consultation/vote. At worst, significant amendments to the agreement will need to be implemented to deal with many of the above concerns.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansI think everyone is overestimating the impact that this new mobility agreement will actually have. The fact remains that there are significant language barriers to entry for any lawyer looking to practice in Quebec.
The value of studying civil law will not be diminished in any way, shape or form. The vast majority of students studying in Quebec law schools plan to stay in Quebec long term. Why would this new agreement persuade them to go study common law in another province?
Moreover, the theoretical differences between Quebec civil law and common law are negligible. First off, Quebec is a bijuridicial system. All Quebec lawyers have at least some exposure to common law through their public law courses in law school. In terms of private law, sure there are some variations in rules and procedure but the differences are incidental. In Quebec, we use precedence much the same that it is used in common law provinces.
As someone who has both a common and civil law eduction I can say that there is nothing a civilian can't learn about the common law by just picking up a treatise. The differences do not justify taking a whole extra year of school plus a separate bar exam. The legal intuition you learn in law school essentially remains the same. It's almost like saying that a lawyer shouldn't be allow to practice insurance law because they didn't take a course in the subject during law school...
The system will not come crumbling down as a result of these new rules...
Kriss Kross
il y a 12 ansI agree with a lot of your points with respect to the minor and technical differences between common law and civil law.
However, I would argue that a student that does 3 years of civil law and one year of common law, should get his/her original call to the Bar in Quebec. Write the Ontario Bar if you want, but your three years of civil law training should culminate in that person getting called via the Quebec bar - they know that system of law best.
Some other points above and below were made as to letting the market decide and value this new process. If I were an Ontario lawyer, and I had a articling/associate candidate that did a three year civil law degree, then did a year of common law (or not) to write the Ontario Bar and skip around the Quebec bar, I would see this as a bit disingenuous. Perhaps Dalhousie or UBC grads don't necessarily write the Nova Scotia or BC Bar, but the market does/will recognize Quebec's unique method of teaching civil law and see this different than the Dal/UBC example.
Also, with this agreement, I think the civil law schools will need to be ranked in Macleans et al. Law School Rankings with the Common Law faculties ... I'm concerned as to how some of our schools will stack up, especially since the rankings are in many ways subjective. The market may indeed decide how to value this new process ... with possible negative consequences for those coming from QC schools.
Me Curieux
il y a 12 ansWill a Quebec lawyer with a common law degree be able to practice in Ontario without writing the ontario bar exams?
Me(e)
il y a 12 ansI think so, so long as you are declared competent in your field of practice in Quebec. I am not sure how this will be assessed, though. Will this limit the area of practice of Quebec lawyers in Ontario or will we enjoy the same privileges as an Ontario lawyer? Not sure.
DSG
il y a 12 ansI have a civil law degree, that's it, and before this it was easier for me to get accreditation to do a deal in the U.S. than it was in Ontario.
And for those people that keep saying that there are such huge differences between civil law and common law, Newsflash: the differences apply only to private law. Our criminal, constitutional, administrative, corporate and other fields of law originate from Common Law. Even certain aspects of the civil code, such as trusts, come from common law. And when interpreting the Civil Code the courts use common law concepts based primarily on jurisprudence.
You people should be happy to have the freedom to move around without needlessly wasting a whole year to get a common law degree. Bunch of complainers!
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansI agree that for most deals where names are changed on templates, there may not be that much of a difference. However, your allegation that "the differences apply ONLY to private law" is very difficult to understand. "Private law" is pretty much the basis for all the other areas, it is the foundation.
Actually, most judges specifically reject common law principles when it comes to interpreting the Civil Code. If you do not know this, I can only assume that you do not read many decisions. That would also explain that you seemingly do not understand the significant differences between the trust in common law and in civil law (i.e. démembrement de droit de propriété vs. patrimoine d’affectation). This type of superficial analysis, ultimately wrong and with possible significant conclusions, is exactly the type of situation that those of us who are concerned are indeed worried about.
Of course, you would know at least some of this if you had taken the time to do an extra year of school, where you actually learn something by the way, and be certified in both jurisdictions.
Lawyer
il y a 12 ansI don't think you'll need to be declared anything :
« La protection du public sera par ailleurs assurée, considérant que les principes de déontologie sont les mêmes à travers le Canada. Ainsi, un avocat hors Québec qui viendrait pratiquer ici ne doit pas accepter de prendre une affaire pour laquelle il n’a pas les connaissances nécessaires et vice versa », ajoute Me Provencher.
Meaning all you'll need is to be called to the Bar in one jurisdiction in Canada, and you're 'de facto' all canadians Bar, bye bye École du barreau
KC
il y a 12 ansBye bye École du barreau for those from McGill or that are willing to do an extra year to get their common law degree which is required in order to be eligible to write the bar exam in Ontario and other Canadian jurisdictions.
mcp
il y a 12 ansExcellente décision du Barreau. Je félicite le bâtonnier et son équipe.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansRien n'empêchera un avocat Ontarien de venir faire ses classes en pratiquant solo au Québec. La partie qui aura en face ce genre d'avocat devra dépenser des sommes folles en correspondance pour lui faire entendre raison chaque fois qu'il fera des actes de procédure incorrects. Cela peut potentiellement coûter cher aux clients, alors que nous avons déjà assez de ce genre d'avocats avant même que l'accord soit en place.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansTel que précédemment cité dans les commentaires:
« La protection du public sera par ailleurs assurée, considérant que les principes de déontologie sont les mêmes à travers le Canada. Ainsi, un avocat hors Québec qui viendrait pratiquer ici ne doit pas accepter de prendre une affaire pour laquelle il n’a pas les connaissances nécessaires et vice versa », ajoute Me Provencher.
Anonyme
il y a 12 ansHeureusement que nous sommes tous des personnes intègres, capables et désireuse de reconnaître facilement nos limites sans être influencés par l'appât du gain (ou le désir de gagner sa vie). Sans quoi, ce commentaire représenterait un voeux pieux, sans plus...